After college and had some $$$ I started collecting them. I have often wondered how well my guns would pattern with modern ammunition. The 12-gauge 3-inch magnum shotshell was developed to achieve this objective. The new 1935-style buttstock featured a closer and fuller pistol grip. A great looking gun, in excellent condition. As good as the Brownings are, Ill just keep my Model 12s from New Haven. I offer the following example from What Rarer Day in Buckinghams book De Shootinest Gentman and Other Tales published in 1934. And make the 42 any grade you want and a self described winchester know it all couldn't tell the differance and may have bought one. The Winchester Model 12 Heavy Duck Gun Proved Itself a Shooter, Colt No Longer Exclusive Owner of M4 Rifle, Mossberg 940 Pro Turkey & Tactical Review: Shotgun Shangri-La, SHOT Show 2023 Picks: Fossari CRX9 Sporting Over/Under, SHOT Show 2023 Picks: Browning Citori High Grade 50th Anniversary, 8 On-Target Concealed Carry Insurance Options (2022), 10 Affordable Double-Barrel Shotgun Options (2022), Best AR-15 Options For Any Budget And Buyers Guide (2022), Best Concealed Carry Handguns For Women (2022). I am anxious to get it back from the engraver. Askins stated in Modern Shotguns and Loads: All shotguns which are intended for long range work.should be patterned at 60 yards. Continuing, loads which pattern around 85% [at 40 yards] have that quality which will permit them to continue a pattern on down the range.Askins found that each yard of range beyond 40 yards reduced pattern density by an average of two percent. seller description. w/ 22" barrel in original box w/ paperwork 1 of 1,000 #UG5 2 Paul Jaeger Jenkintown, PA. 30-06 cal. Included with the gun is its orig, Winchester Model 12, 28 Gauge in very good to near fine original condition. Must ship to an FFL. This is why they were rust blued instead of hot blued. Metal parts of the Model 12 are machined from chrome-molybdenum, the toughest, longest wearing and finest gun steel known. Barrel lengths were 30 or 32 inches, but 32-inch barrels were discontinued in 1948. I had a friend who is deceased now that did extensive research on the Model 12 2-pin rib. You are also correct that the different rib styles used on Model 12's can get confusing..EG. The Olins used the Western ammunition plant at East Alton, Illinois, as collateral for borrowing about four million in cash, no small feat in the fall of 1931. Winchester Model 12 with checkered forearm (slide handle) b'. I have a questionwhen a gun is described as having a "milled rib" I thought that referred to the fact that the barrel had posts that were milled as part of the barrel instead of being attachedI see guns described as having "round post milled ribs" I don't think that is correct? Smith brand, by the A.H. Fox Company of Philadelphia, by Parker, and by Ithaca. In the 1950's Winchester's costs were losing pace with what they were ablle to sell their products for. Winchester Model 1300 Speed Pump - 12 GA $395.00: 0 $395.00 5d 15h 14m This product contains chemicals known to the state of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm. Ithaca brought out their Magnum 10double to use the new shell. Both guns have 30-inch Full choke barrels inscribed FOR SUPER SPEED & SUPER-X 3 IN. The bores are bright with no pitting. It is not as slow or pokey as one might expect. The staff shot skeet with the gun and concluded It is not as fast as the standard Model-12, but nearly so., In further shooting tests the staff found We could not discern any practical difference in recoil effect when shooting standard three inch heavy duck loads. Winchester supplied two boxes of 3-inch shells loaded with 1 3/8-ounces of #5 chilled shot pushed by four drams equivalent of powder. rifle w/ Jaeger Quick Detachable scope mount 3 Remington mod. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. An incredible collector grade limited production 1953 Model 12 HEAVY DUCK GUN SIMMONS VENT RIB that is offered below Blue Book value. Down pitch remained 2-1/2 inches with the 30-inch barrel throughout production. Remington re-tooled from the M31 to the stamp, push and press 870 which sold for less than the M12. A smothered roar from around the corner! We join Buckingham in his ducking skiff as he is poled through the bayou by Ab, his black guide. This little shotgun appears to have never been assembled and and has a 28 inch full choke barrel. In an ad in the October 1952 American Rifleman, Winchester proclaimed. *** RARE *** Winchester Model 12 HEAVY DUCK GUN limited production run that combines the pre-64 Model 12 with a 12 ga. Magnum 30" barrel, factory production 3" Magnum, with a factory Simmons Vent Rib on an upgraded wood stock! The near nine-pound Model 12 duck gun is an anachronism among todays waterfowl hunting shotguns. Winchester stated both 2 1/2 and 2 3/4 shells perform satisfactorily in this [duck] gun. The ejection port of the duck gun is about 1/8-inch longer than the standard port. the barrel and chamber are bright and clean. Western brought out their Super-X 2-3/4 and 3-inch shotshells in 1921. The earliest gun they found with a 2-pin rib has a serial number of 2037xx with a date of June 30th, 1919. The slide handle was given a larger diameter, flat bottom and 14 grooves on each side of the handle about 1947. Ducks Unlimited was born in 1937 to aid in restoration of wetland breeding areas, primarily in Canada. To elaborate on lowgun's response, the "round post" rib was made by Simmons, not Winchester. My favorite 2 pins were Trap Guns made between 1957-1959 including special order Pigeon grades; fit, finish and blueing was best in those later years. But they must pass our way to clear! The first thing you notice when you pick up a duck gun is its weight and solid feel. Winchester Model 12 Shotguns For Sale Shotgun Winchester Model 12. or Rudy Dozenrod out of Wyndemere, S.D. Winchester Model 12 1940's gun. Checkered semi-fancy walnut pistol grip stock with extended forearm and a solid Winchester recoil pad. Introduced in 20 gauge in 1912, 16 and 12 gauge guns followed in 1914. I was glad to see this as I know for a fact that while many weren't done, they did indeed do some. Their attitude is summed up by Elmer Keith in Shotguns by Keith: the satisfaction of seeing big ducks crumple at long range and come down and bounce on the ground or splash high in the water is the cream of shotgun shooting., It is my view that the long-range duck-hunting cult was a legacy from the days of market hunting. The receiver is heavier and so is the barrel. My gun is a pump action Model 12 shotgun with a grooved slide handle (forearm). Come join the discussion about targets, clays, hunting, gunsmithing, gear reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! Winchester Model 12 16 ga NIB Never Assembled! of a company that is committed to your satisfaction. 1937 2pin vent rib offerd, all skeet grade guns offerd with solid or plain barrels. becouse plain barrels shoot higher than solid ribs do ,solid ribs shoot flatter. Its been debated over the years if the solid rib model 12 barrel were silver brazed or fused with heat? The slide lock is automatically released by the forward nudge of recoil in the Model 12. Nash Buckingham was one of the great duck-hunting writers of the period. Each fired target was turned over and a 30-inch cardboard disc placed to cover the maximum number for pellet holes. Blue is good showing wear on high spots. This is not John Waynes revolver it is a modern work of art! Come join the discussion about optics, hunting, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! Although acquired many years apart, the two duck guns are of nearly the same vintages, 1952 and 1953. at the best online prices at eBay! A red rubber Winchesterre coil pad was added the first year of production. Western rapidly achieved a leading position in the ammunition industry through innovation and skillful management. Jack OConnor was there and sets the scene nicely in the Complete Book of Shooting. Results and Discussion The paired pattern percentages fired by the two duck guns with each of the five loads were not significantly different, judging by the overlapping standard deviations. Recent 3 1/2-inch 12-gauge shells will create dangerous pressure in the 3-inch duck gun chamber. Duck hunters bought 12-gauge doubles with 3-inch chambers to use the new Super-X magnum load, the Super Twelve as it was soon called. Winchester was bankrupt and went into receivership in January 1931. When I dress Western, nothing beats the classic good looks of my Smith & Wesson (S&W) 586 .357 revolver. The Model 21 double seemed the reasonable choice for Winchesters duck gun. the ventilated rib is by simmons gin works. From its debut until the end of the 1950's, the Winchester Model 1912 was the pump shotgun, long known as "the perfect repeater." Very fine as professionally custom finished, showing 95% of the refurbished blue, with scattered rust spotting and handling marks. MAKE OFFER. Interchangeable barrels (forend assembly) for 2 3/4-inch shells and choke of choice were special order. Terms and Conditions and Privacy Policy. My 1951 Winchester Ammunition Handbook gives a comparison of 17 to 11 feet at 60 yards. generous return policy, and handle everything you dont have to go back to This gun is in excellent condition and has very desireable solid rib barrel with full choke. Pattern percentages were around 70% with these latter loads. Small depression in the magazine tube, as shown in pictures. Guns.com's selection won't leave you feeling unprepared. But getting back to the original question, a Simmons rib does detract from the value of a Model 12 and most people will turn away from them. It is the skeet style of stock with a comb drop of 1 1/2 2 1/2 inches, and a 14-inch length, butt to trigger. Free shipping for many products! H. Lea Lawrence relates in his 2001 GUN DIGEST article, The Saga of Bo Whoop, that in 1921 John Olin sent Buckingham his personal heavy double, a custom-choked Super Fox, for testing. Teal, mallard, widgeon and sprig [pintail] hover singly and in bunches overhead. prior written consent of the Copyright holder. Checkered stocks and extension slide handles were available as options on the standard grade throughout most of the duck guns production. Not sure how many of you know this, but the rib has a serial number stamped on the underside of them with the same number stamped on the underside of the barrel. Dolphin, I agree with you until the part where you imply that Model 12s were sent to Simmons for ribs and then sent back to Winchester to sell. I don't believe their ever was a royalty, actually Simmons kept selling his special vent rib model 12's after the 1955 introduction of the Winchester Special Vent Rib @ New Haven. By signing up you agree to Guns.com's Both guns were disassembled, cleaned and lightly oiled before testing. , Winchester - Model 12, Deluxe, Pump Action, RARE 28ga. Get 12 Issues a year of the country's best firearms writing. I believe the blueing to be original. These were turned out by the Hunter Arms Company of Fulton, N.Y. in L.C. Winchester ~ Model 12 Trap ~ Pump Action Shotgun ~ 12 Gauge. First of all was the end of management by people who were not familiar or sympathetic with the gun and ammunition business. The Olins were avid duck hunters. In 1963, when production ended, Riffles book shows no options available. another state. It is in excellent condition with only light handing marks, Used Browning BT99 Plus 12 gauge 28" bbl fixed choke mod good condition no box no manuals Buyer pays shipping Millers Gun Center Located in New Castle, Delaware "Home of TAX, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 16GA PUMP ACTION SHOTGUN, 26" BBL, 2 3/4, POLY CHOKE, RIBLESS, EJECTORS, SINGLE TRIGGER, MEDIUM DARK FIGURED WALNUT, PISTOL GRIP, LOP 14 3/8, 1 1/2, 2 5/16, 7LBS 3OZ, 985 BLUE, Winchester. Initially came a series of auto-loading rifles, including the rimfire Model 1903 and centerfire rifles, culminating with the Model 1910, chambered for the 401 WSL cartridge. Winchester made changes to the stock of the Model 12 duck gun after its introduction. Since you in Kansas; ever deal with now deceased Felix Bedlan @ Fairbury, Neb. Simmons also removed Solid Ribs from barrels and added his rib to those barrels. However, killing ducks at long range remained the objective of many duck hunters. Blue Book on this fine collector 12 gauge is around $2,700! The steel has a nice patina and the stock has most of the lacquer worn off. You have entered an incorrect email address! Shooting the Model 12 Duck Gun I own two Model 12 duck guns. This test determines if excessive peening of the bolt locking cut in the receiver has occurred. Winchester - Model 12 Factory Try-Gun, 12ga, 30" Barrel. As far as early 2 pins, remember there were a few made as early as 1919, standard and "graded" model 12's (ie) "Black Diamaonds" they had the longer checkered forearm. The Model 12 duck guns are still as suitable for waterfowl passes, fox trails or the habitat of the wary gobbler as they were when the duck hunters at Winchester surprised the market in 1935. I am tempted to stop off awhile and call. Guns.com pledges to make gun buying easy, to support local gun stores, and to serve our The balance point is the takedown joint. Winchester Model 12 16Ga Pump Shotgun 28" Excellent condition Made in 1939 Gun #: 903285649 Seller: JerArms GA Sales: 60 $872.00 Full Details More from this Seller 1 Image (s) Winston Churchill custom Winchester Model 12 Pigeon 20 gauge, gold relief, staggering wood, provenan. during that time I handled many M-12's of varying configurations. Lot 6593: Winchester Model 42 Slide Action Shotgun . - Top Rated Plus - opens in a new window or tab, - eBay Money Back Guarantee - opens in a new window or tab. Then people would choose a grade of model 12 and add or change things to ther hunting or shooting style. I still have a few 2nd style action slides left. service to the online gun buying experience that is unheard of. 31 12 ga. pump shotgun w/ Simmons ventilated rib - walnut checkered stock & forearm - & 30" John Olin wanted a new 3-inch .410 shotshell with 3/4-ounce of shot for Winchesters new Model 42. As to price, it will also depend on gauge, barrel length, choke, barrel steel, wood type, pad vs. plate, etc. Very good condition overall. Thus it was that the American Rifleman staff thought it odd that Winchester brought out the 3-inch chamber in their Model 12 pump gun. Ronald Stadt states in Winchester Shotguns and Shot-shells: All Winchester special ventilated rib magnum guns examined have sand-blasted receiver tops. Solid ribs were offered until the mid-1950s, except as noted by Stadt: The 1960 wholesale-retail catalog listed 30-inch solid rib pidgeon magnums. Olin included his new Super-X magnum 3-inch shells loaded with 1 3/8 ounces of shot. Save my name and email to use for future comments. Saint Charles, Missouri. Everything functions as it should. The solid rib gun shows carrying wear while the ventilated rib gun was refinished when the rib was installed. The deeply blued barrel and receiver frame are very good. 12 Gauge, This is a very nice Winchester Model 12 Trap pump action shotgun in 12 gauge. Winchester sent some M-12s to Simmons to have ribs installed, Simmons returned them to Win. Delivery times may vary, especially during peak periods. His shotguns were undoubtedly the best long-range duck guns he found in extensive testing. Get Guns.com offers and news!! This Model 12 has Serial Number 1391884 was produced in 1953. Instead of buying a gun thats . Factroy finish on metal, custom wood. Riffle's excellent reference book on the Model 12 notes the 1919 patent date for the two-pin rib, but suggests that the rib was not on the market until 1920. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Winchester proof steel is chrome-molybdenum steel. BARREL 30" CHOKE FULL 90% FACTORY BLUE ORIGINAL FACTORY HEAVY DUCK RECOIL PAD WOOD VERY GOOD. Fanciers of long-range shotguns now had a 12-gauge repeater shooting a 10-gauge shot load. Mechanically, the Model 12 duck gun differs little in design from the standard Model 12. The load averaged 67.5% (range 62-72.5%), in a 30-inch circle at 40 yards. 30" Vent Rib Excellent White Front . Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. The stock is the upgraded Monte Carlo style capped pistol grip, heavy pad, upgraded wood, and cheek rest. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Winchester Model 12 12 ga 26" oal aftermarket poly choke and vent rib at the best online prices at eBay! This is a shotgun I should never have sold. The shotgun featured here was made in 1976 and is in stellar condition. Its been debated over the years if the solid rib model 12 barrel were silver brazed or fused with heat? Every cowboy needs a revolver. Click here for more information. Severe drought conditions gripped the United States and Canada during the 1930s. Consider the possibility of a hang-fire, an occasional event in 1912, in a gun without the slide lock feature. Chamber marked 3", choke marked full, and 14 1/2" LOP. 4 chilled shot.. A Cold War era classic with smooth lines, a legendary back story, and an exotic-sounding name, Beretta's Model 71 was definitely a mouse that roared. Thereafter, a staggering number of variations were produced during the 1912-1980 period. Great communications. The Simmons rib is done at Winchesters direction as it has the WP proof offset from the rib. I hunker down and blaze away. Options for the Model 12 duck gun were reduced over the years, particularly following World War II. Twelve magnum guns grew lighter over the years and consequently kick harder. It won't be a collector but a shooter and should draw some attention. - for PayPal Credit, opens in a new window or tab, about earning points with eBay Mastercard, Report this item - opens in new window or tab. Winchester advises Do not use steel shot in any Winchester shotgun with a fixed choke. Use tungsten polymer, tungsten matrix or bismuth shot for waterfowl hunting with your Model 12 duck gun. My 1953 duck gun has the factory solid rib. bolt act. Original appearing donut post and round post vent rib Model 12s with no Simmons markings and proof marks in the proper places are generally thought by collectors to have been made to completion in the Winchester factory. Edwin Pugsley, in charge of Winchester at the time of receivership, is quoted in Williamsons book: The purchase of the company by the Olin interests brought a breath of life to the institution and brought to Winchester many things. community. A new chamber ring and a # 1 heavy draw adjusting sleeve. Epic 22 Pocket Pistol: The Beretta 71 Jaguar. WE DO NOT SHIP INTERNATIONALLY $40 Shipping. This is a correct factory Skeet grade 28 gauge with solid rib on the 26 skeet choked barrel. Winchester installed Simmons ribs and Simmons-designed ventilated ribs for several years. Refresh your browser window to try again. As you know that, Winchester Model 12 (factory original) 28-gauge pump action shotgun. Dolphin717, please give us a page reference in Stadt where he mentions Simmons sending Model 12s with ribs back to Winchester for finishing, and/or marketing. Some patterns of #4 shot might let a duck escape if it were caught just inside the margin of the 30-inch circle. (no choke stamp on barrel). Askins concludes How far are we going to be able to kill ducks? Did they actually produce any in 1919 or did it take some time to get them out to the public after patent was approved? I worked in two gun shops when I was in college. The locked breech bolts of both guns have little perceptible play when the rear of the bolt is pressed from the side. The trap load was included because trap shooting is suited to the duck gun. So here is a history lesson on the skeet grade. For small bores, there are still new factory wood sets available. Tried to talk him out of doing it and sell him a build up gun but he wanted a vent rib on it as it was his dad's gun. Winchester suggests their 3-inch 12-gauge shotshells with 1 3/8-ounces or 1 5/8-ounces of #4 shot for wildfowl hunting in their 1951 Ammunition Handbook: These shells were developed especially for extremes in long range shooting with 12-gauge Winchester Model 12 and Model 21 Heavy Duck Guns.. He spent many years as firearms editor for Outdoor Life and later Field and Stream, as well as shotgun editor for the American Rifleman. I would think if you did shoot you proble flinch like heck becouse ther must be a lot of jerk in you. The barrel is stamped "WS 1" with 2 3/4, ****SOLD******Mfg 1956, 30" 2-Pin Vent Rib, Full, B-Carved Wood, 13 3/4" Lop to Winchester Pad, Wood shows some handling marks Nothing Bad, 90-95% Blue, Shiney Bore, Buyer pays 60.00 shippin. The straighter stock reduced perceived recoil. Keith stated in 1967: The old 70% standard is now obsolete and most any full choke gun will go 75% or better. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. Also available initially were standard trap and special trap grades. Model 12 Skeet Pump Shotgun. Length of pull was reduced in January 1936 to reflect the extra clothing worn by duck hunters. Buttstocks of duck guns had lead slugs inserted into the wood beneath the recoil pad. The committee appointed to study the requirements for continuing business reported a successful reorganization would require the raising of a substantial amount of new capital. That capital was supplied by the Olin family of Olin Industries, owners of Western Cartridge Company. Field grade pump gun with Mod choke barrel. The $48 price tag was right. His Super Fox 12 gauge magnum double averaged 83.7% (two-barrel average) of 1 3/8ounces of shot under the same conditions. the store. Both guns averaged 80% or better patterns with all loads of #4 shot. JavaScript is disabled. Action works very nicely. Thomas C. Johnson came to Winchester in 1885 and remained a dedicated employee until his death in 1934. winchester model 12 heavy duck gun 30" simmons vent rib 1953 pre-64 rare 12 ga. magnum 3" edition proof marking - 12 gauge magnum - 5 - 30 " A 2pin vent rib lets the shooter sight under the bird and keep the bird in sight. The era of plentiful ducks and liberal bag limits was also ending. Buckinghams tests led him to buy his own custom Super Fox, Bo Whoop. Bo Whoop patterned about 90% at 40 yards with specially bored barrels. Winchester designed the Model 42 to use the new shell and the combo went to market in 1932. Tommy, I would be interested in one of the guns you describe. I pick them up through the interlacing covert, a bunch of suspicious mallards driving for safety. Franklin and his two sons John M. Olin and Spencer T. Olin were the managers of Olin Industries and Western Cartridge Company in 1931. Reduced bag limits and shell capacities for repeating shotguns were introduced. MAKE OFFER. President Roosevelt signed the law limiting magazine repeaters to three shells for migratory game bird hunting in 1935. But for some reason, buying a gun online can The 3-inch shell was chambered originally in the famous Super Fox long-range double. In fact, Madis states Any twelve gauge Model Twelve could be re-chambered and reworked to shoot three inch shells for a small additional charge[by Winchester], yet few guns were reworked in this way. I can find no external differences in receiver dimensions, other than the ejection port, between standard and magnum versions. Dave Riffle in his book, The Greatest Hammerless Repeating Shotgun Ever Built: The Model 12 1912-1964, states The Winchester Model 12 was, and still remains, the only gun that was offered in over 100 different variations or configurations during its lifetime. It is fair to say that Winchester produced Model 12 shotguns for every conceivable shotgunning special interest group, including duck hunters. Loose bolts and excess head-space occur only after long service. The takedown joints are tight (See the instructions in Madis book if your Model 12 has a loose take-down joint). ONLY ONE EVER PRODUCED BY WINCHESTER, ULIMATE RARITY. . It is at my engraver now. I always wondered what the royalty was to Simmons on the Winchester Special Ventilated Rib that they installed. No Reserve. The rib wasn't offered until 1954 according to the Dave Riffle Model 12 book so it wasn't originally produced at the Winchester Factory. Experts can attest to the vast improvements they have found shooting with the Simmons Ventilated Rib. A Simmons Rib has been added to the barrel and the metal was refinished. No Reserve. Harold Williamson, in his book Winchester, The Gun That Won the West, relates that the new management of Winchester embarked on a program that involved an extraordinary departure from the companys previous operations and the investment of borrowed capital in large amounts. Winchester struggled through a decade of inept product diversification that was terminated by the Great Depression. Model 12 duck guns could be ordered in pidgeon grade, featuring fancy wood and meticulous fitting and finish of parts. There are 3 possible models that you might have: 1) Your Model 12 has a grooved slide handle and with a 'F' stamped after the serial number and has a lightweight alloy trigger guard. It is general consensus that 10 patterns are required for an accurate appraisal of a given load and barrel combination. The marsh is in riot! Need Help?service@guns.comCall (866)582-4867, PO Box 1131 13800 Nicollet Blvd Burnsville, MN 55337 2023Guns.com. Just to add th the issue, here's a note that I copied from Trapshooters.com some time age. , The Winchester Model 12 Y series was introduced in 1972 and made until about 1984. Winchester Model 12 Takedown Slide Action Shotgun with Simmons Ventilated RibProduced in 1961. Winchester Custom Model 12 20ga Deluxe GI#: 102228842 Winchester Custom Model 12 20ga 2 3/4" 28" full choke barrel,Simmons vent rib,serial #683559,fancy French Walnut checkered stocks with great color and figure,jeweled bolt and lifter,ex .Click for more info Seller: First Stop Gun Area Code: 605 $1,750.00 Helping out a person with 3378 posts who if they spent 5min. Exquisite Winchester Model 12, 20 gauge with Modified bore. Madis states Winchester spent a great deal of time and effort to develop better chokes. Furthermore, Winchester constantly experimented, searching for improvements in all chokes, even the old standby full choke. Winchester almost certainly would have perfected their Full-choke Model 12 duck gun to maximize patterns with #4 lead shot, the size most mentioned for long-range duck shooting in publications prior to the advent of non-toxic shot. I sold 41 model 12's and 21's at a gun auction in Wichita Kansas to accommodate the move. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Winchester ~ Model 12 Custom~ 12 GA Used Guns. George Madis indicates in his book The Winchester Model Twelve that about 18,000 Model 12 duck guns were sold during the 1935-1941 period. Standard markings, with matching numbers on the receiver and barrel. Winchester recognized the scarcity of ducks in their promotional advertisement of the new duck gun To Meet the New Wildfowling Conditions. I suspect most Model 12 duck guns bought before World War II were put to work on other game. I recently acquired a 1921 gun. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Also, it was the only 1 3/8-ounce magnum load available. I fired 10 patterns for each of the five test loads in each of the two duck guns, for a total of 100 patterns. Writing in the March 1927 issue of the American Rifleman, Askins reports that his Remington Model 10 12-gauge pump averaged 89% of 1 1/4-ounces of shot in a 3-inch circle at 40 yards. Some will even go 85% to 90%, but rarely. Keith, who obtained Askins Ithaca 10 magnum double upon Askins death, achieved 93% patterns with two ounces of copper-plated#3 shot in the big double.

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